the reason its damage is low is because its base level is 120
This is not a buff. I already do over 144 damage with my basic blasts without awakening or any synergies. (Iām waiting to awaken my poison mage until after patches come out)
Poisonās whole gimmick is that it does double damage via itās DoT.
0.75x + 0.75x from the DoT.
What the heck would be the point of me using an ultimate blast if the DoT does less damage than a basic blast?
Personally I donāt see the problem with DoTās being based on damage dealt either.
Whatās the fuss? Why change it? Shouldnāt the flames from an ultimate burn harder than a regular blast?
If itās about stuff like 20x multi blasts taking up the debuff slot why not just let stronger versions of the same debuff override significantly weaker ones?
The ultimate art for magics apply the dot twice
Letting stronger dots override weaker ones is definitely a good change, I think.
But then itās questionable how does it work in other cases - if you have weaker dots applied to a stronger dot. Does it no longer extend the duration? Or does it extend the duration of the stronger dot. If itās the latter, thatās a very strong buff as poison would then be able to infinitely maintain a strong dot with many weaker less committal options. Something to think about, but I do think itās the correct way to approach the issue.
I didnāt think Iād have to reiterate this, but Ash Magic at its weakest (nerfed by high vitality, no equipment) is better at close range than my fighting style, which is designed to be used at close range. Even my friend thinks it needs a big nerf, and he loves Ash Magic enough to theme his clan around it. Now, Iāve only fought Ash Magic with warlock, and Iāve never used it myself, so I wanted to give it the benefit of the doubt in case nerfing it too much ruins its viability against other match-ups. So I suggested the slightest nerf I could think of, making it so if you parry an Ash/Poison attack it makes a weaker cloud (not even blocking, it has to be a parry), which I believe would be barely enough for fighting styles to stand a chance against cloud magics up close. I donāt know how thereās still someone trying to minimize this problem when I was trying to take caution, but it is what it is I guess.
As a Poison Main. I have to say that Intesity Cloud build (poison) is useless.
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I highly doubt vitality is a factor here considering the damage from ash and poison clouds seems to only be changed by level where even power and intensity has no effect to which I highly doubt vitality would decrease it as well. Your friend likely just has a good build to make use of that interaction whether its bugged or intended. Area denial is literally the identity of ash as it suffers from lower end stats damage and speed because it has larger size and clouds. If you are getting outdamaged by a 26 DPS ash cloud and 0.85x impact damage non-mage, itās more likely a bad build or fighting styles being in a bad place and needing a buff rather than ash being the problem. Parrying the attack wouldnāt even be a good fix as ash users at higher levels would just shoot around you or use self-explosion to hide in a cloud.
If anything this a problem with how DoT is calculated and how impact damage and how it is tied to aura and the power stat itself. Right now status effects give way too much damage like how metal can have 100-150 more damage than earth simply because it has bleed or how magma can do probably over 250-300 damage through melt on a single ultimate art at no cost. Poison is just in a weird spot because they gave it long duration and insanely low base damage where pretty much any other DoT is better, and when you try and fix this like what is suggested, it would just run into these problems because of those stats.
Neither of us had armor or accessories
It would have to be based on the difference between the current DoT and the oncoming one.
I think a decent way to go about it would be something likeā¦
Weak poison ā Poison ā Strong poison
Multihit moves, pulses, and other weak moves will inflict weak poison,
blasts, explosions, and other āregularā moves could inflict regular poison,
charged moves, ultimates, and other powerful attacks inflict strong poison.
Lesser poisons are overridden by stronger poisons.
Another approach would be to use math but thatās not my strong suit.
Seriously, what problem does this solve?
I still want an answer as to why this is on the doc to begin with.
I canāt see what problem this is attempting to fix and just feels like a global nerf to non-stun status magics.
If the answer is because of this idea right here, I also have to askā¦ Why implement it so thoughtlessly? This appears to have been written without considering magics with strong/reliance on damaging status.
Admittedly itās mostly poison for now, but Iād imagine future magics would also have this problem.
Why not just do something like Queue DoTās that hit right before the end of the previous if this is an attempt to fix some awkwardness with how DoTās canāt be reapplied/override?
Iām assuming this is a suggestion and already not the case, but it wouldnāt really solve the problem, as now my poison ultimateās do an additional 288 damage overā¦ 30 secondsā¦
Thatās just worse than the current state, as Iād get that with no investment off of a quick cast ultimate blast with no intensity or power.
It would just be easier and more consistent to have stronger DoTās overwrite weaker ones, based on a formula using time and damage difference, or to have DoTās of the same type queue up if the current one is near expiry.
Okay so from this we can discuss the problem and come up with a better solution.
Just going to drop my text block before discussion continues.
When I said build, I moreso meant the stat distribution and how it ties to the idea how having the high vitality may decrease damage, but ash cloud damage isnāt affected by it and therefore negates the downsides. Along with this, item stats like power and certain things like power aura are based on the base stats of the magic/weapon/etc., meaning something like ash with power would not scale as well compared to someone with earth and equal power. Even then, pretty sure balance is based moreso on endgame rather than having no items to form opinions and scenarios that will rarely matter.
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I think the best way to solve this problem is to come up with one that throttles insane DoT damage with power while using poisons 100% base damage to status ratio to leave it untouched (as it doesnāt really have any problems rn, and is infact in need of a buff.)
Am I the only person who uses Glass as a primary element (particularly in a hybrid build) and feels like it should receive more relevant buffs other than just having itās rubble fixed?
Most of itās stats are quite average to justify itās low damage multiplied and how honestly useless Bleed currently is.
Please consider either giving Glass a stacking bleed or the ability of inflicting a āstrongerā bleed than normal bleed. Imbuement with glass is honestly just nerfing your own damage, as weapons already normally deal bleed.
They honestly just dug themselves a hole with how these DoTs work but if anything, Iād suggest they keep the current system, gut every DoT to around a third or fourth of what they are, and have intensity increase the impact damage to DoT ratio. This would make it so that if players want to have the absurd DoT they have now, they would have to invest into intensity while magics with higher initial DoT values like poison would scale harder with intensity as doubling the impact damage into DoT ratio would mean much less for say bleed doing 7% of impact to 14% with intensity compared to poison being maybe 33% to 66% with intensity. These would obviously also scale higher up to some diminishing returns with very high intensity at possibly 3x its original ratio as something like poison would return to its 99-100% ratio.
Iād like to leave poison at 100% if you donāt mind, thatās why I think its so cool 
The problem isnāt really in the base values as, for example, magmaās DoT is perfectly fine when you have no power or intensity. I think the best solution is just to change how power affects statusā, as it really shouldnāt be affecting them much to begin with.
Especially with the proposed rework to intensity, as that makes it the āPowerā of status damage.
If I was to throw out another solution, powerās influence over statusā could be based on the statusā strength, ex:
30% of your damage status = gets 30% of the benefit from your power stat than the impact does.
So if your base damage was 100, and your power was bananas enough to double your damageā¦
The impact does 200 damage, while the DoT does I thiiiiinkā¦ 39, instead of what would be 60 in current patch. Please do correct me if Iām wrong, Iām no math wizard.
Magmaās DoT with its current impact damage and around 47% impact damage DoT with power is pretty crazy. Blasts would be doing like 150 more damage for free and ultimate arts maybe 225 more, give or take.
I know players like the 100% ratio which is why I suggested what I did. Players would be able to return to the current status effect DoT levels again with high intensity (think about when item stats are much crazier later on) while making intensity a at minimum beneficial stat for a good amount of magics. Obviously after gutting the current ratios to a third, something like poison would still scale with it harder as comparing the post-suggested-nerf comparison of bleed (7-21%) and poison (33-99%) with very high levels of intensity.
Makes statuses more consistent, reduces weak hits,
Whatās your issue with this? The only downside I can think of is the fact that it extends the amount of time before you can reapply the DoT for the full 20 seconds.
Hereās how I see that situation going:
- 5 seconds left for your DoT
- You hit them during this time and it extends the time
- It ends and you donāt get the 20-second DoT
- You hit them again and the DoT is up again for the full 20 seconds
In my honest opinion the āqueueā idea could be a better idea. But the idea that this is some huge nerf to DoT reliant magics makes no sense to me. Especially if the status already lasts so long that 3 hits = 80% of the entire fight duration.
That being said, this is not about āwould this be a bad idea or not.ā Itās about what the best idea would be, so yeah weāll consider this.
Always reduced damage rather than increased, Vet said itās doomed so no more stacking.
Forgot to consider most of your damage comes from power so Iād also add Power to that equation.
Other than that however I think an āoverall nerfā is kind of a crazy accusation when most of your damage isnāt gonna come from using ur ult art either way.
I like the consistency of having the DoT not based on your attackās damage. Balances out the extremes between low-damage and high-damage attacks, especially if most of your attacks are just gonna be 100% blasts anyways.
I can see ur point of making ult art underwhelming though (although ult art only multiplies base damage by 20% and not even power, so does it even really matter that much?)
Would you consider glass as a DoT reliant magic?
Sure, itās damage multiplier (at least the raw DMG. Not counting the DoT) isnāt as low as poison, but itās very comparable. If you count the DoT, poison should most of the times out damage glass, wouldnāt it?
Also, I just canāt understand why someone would use Glass Imbuement if it is basically just a damage nerf (weapons already normally deal bleed. I donāt know if speed and size are inherited by imbuement, but even if they are, glass has only 1x speed and 1.1x size. Meaning glass imbuement would only get a minor size buff in exchange for a sizeable DMG nerf.)
Yea, itās mid otherwise
With clouds maybe. DoT alone it depends on how competent you are at hitting your target, Glass would deal more if youāre better.
Actually true this should be looked into.
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Previously on this topic the idea of bleed stacking was brought as a special āpassiveā for glass magic.
Either that or the ability of glass magic to turn bleed into a better version of bleed after hitting a target which is already bleeding.
Both of those would actually make it so glass imbuement has a reason to be used and it would also make glass a bit better. It would also definitely play with the strengths the magic already has such as area denial with the rubble and the whole stuff about focusing on DoT.