There is a surprisingly prevalent market for selling accounts
Yep, that’s what I’m talking about
nah i think its valid
I saw “I kill low levels” and sorta just immediately went “nah this is probably just all yap”
its yap but its fun yap
Well yeah, I was just giving rough examples and of course there will always be people who find their way around stuff
I got a friend to hunt me and I hunted him back to get the champion egg too, so I guess I technically am one of those people too
But these were no suggestions, just hypothetical “additions”. I haven’t thought about how these were going to be added if at all, let alone creating rules to prevent people from gaining them easily
None of this is yap unfortunately. 
still valid
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i’ll be honest i’m like really tired right now but i did read somewhat through the post and all of its responses (forgive me if tiredness means I missed something) but here’s my thoughts on the matter… after context:
i have over 200 hours on the game (not the biggest value i’ve seen but still pretty respectable), have a clan that’s just me and an IRL friend that’s over your 2000 infamy benchmark, and used to have over 300k renown as a PvE player before the deckhand rework got me to wipe it
while i do think witch hunting shouldn’t be allowed in any context personally, i also don’t disagree with your point that some people should be punished for toxicity- but this point in particular stuck out to me because I recalled seeing a proposed change in the balance doc that forces players to not be neutral in order to take player hunts from bounty boards, which i feel would help mitigate this situation since they would be forced to risk their infamy to gain more
there’s still probably better ways to release frustrations against clans, i sure as heck have no clue since i’m not all that big in PvP
the problem right now with ganking low levels is less that it’s an intended thing to be happening, I feel- when more content comes out random ganks like this will become less and less common since right now a pretty notable issue with the game is that since there isn’t a whole lot of PvE content right now (it all eventually becomes samey) people will turn to PvP to continue getting enjoyment out of the game. This isn’t a bad thing by any means, but it just means that the amount of people getting ganked for little reason or as fodder is abnormally high right now, a problem that would prooooooobably get fixed when town/kingdom alignment and especially professions are added?
in addition, just in general getting ganked and being unable to fight back sucks, even if there’s not a whole lot to lose. I’m a huge proponent of the idea that a new player’s experience is of the utmost importance, since if the onboarding process for new players to your game is too painful then new players will just stop playing the game, which will ultimately lead to a game dying. AO isn’t at risk of this right now, but it’s something to keep in mind for the future.
100% agree with this statement, and there should be a way to cap your renown at 10-20k in either direction, PvE players not getting to higher renown would solve a good chunk of problems with random ganking
the main problem with this mindset are the people who want nothing to do with PvP whatsoever, they want to engage in the exploration aspects of the game so being forced into PvP they don’t want a part of is a bit of an antithesis to this idea, and it’s not a mindset most players would be able to adopt easily
the aforementioned clan I’m in is mostly just there because it’s for fun and i have a friend who plays the game, sure i like seeing number go up but right now clans are solidified as the PvP feature… UNTIL the Empires update comes out, and people will want in on that regardless of if they’re PvP or PvE. I predict that the complaints about PvE clans (both from PvE players in them complaining about being PK’d and from PvP players complaining about being complained about or other things) will be exacerbated once there’s more than just bragging rights and a bigger clan bank behind having higher level clans (since I assume some structures would require higher tier clans or maybe some upgrades would)
yeah, dying to an Atlantean and dying to a PvP player both seem similar on paper but in practice they’re wholly different- this has to do with the fact that PvP players force PvE players to engage in PvP- and also if you die to an Atlantean it feels like it’s more of your fault than the fault of whoever ganks you when you’re returning from the Dark Sea and get killed- another part of it is the aspect of losing things to people- you could have been in the Dark Sea for 5 hours getting 60+ sealed chests only for someone to bum rush you as soon as you’re out and steal all that progress in the span of 2-4 minutes
everyone’s entertainment is subjective, if this sort of thing is what gives you entertainment then I can’t judge you for that- heck, if I was good at PvP I might be more inclined to share this mindset for the funnies since i would be more able to defend my ego in that case
the main issue here is that since this inherently requires other people getting upset, the people who would be most impacted by this are the people who don’t share the mindset of feinboy19 like you’ve mentioned, the people who get easily bruised egos or can get very fiery very quickly would end up complaining to heck and back about this which could leak into their opinions trickling down to people who don’t have any involvement with the situation and give the impression that the community is toxic (i’m not exactly denying that, there’s a few people I’ve heard about or seen that can fit that bill, but the problem here would be that the toxicity would be unnecessarily overexaggerated)
i’ve mentioned a bit above in this post, but i have a feeling that the Empires update is going to make PvE clans more prominent and potentially exacerbate the problems therein, at least for a while as people adjust to it. It’ll revitalize the clan scene, but it will also undoubtedly change it as well since it won’t just be a PvP feature any more, regardless of if it would be intended as such. It’s the same problem as with Deckhands requiring renown.
------ (separation of quoting and personal thoughts)
overall, while i’m not really a fan of some of the ideas you seem to enjoy, reading through this post at least showed me that there are still some reasonable people that might get lumped in with the PvE player’s hate towards the PvP scene- i personally think that low levels shouldn’t be getting ganked at all (due to the aforementioned new player experience) but i can’t exactly stop anyone from ganking them for renown/infamy
at the same time, it’s also been iterated and reiterated again and again that the biggest problem with the PvP aspects of this game is that someone could be forced into them, and this thread has given another problem with it that it’s not the main focus of the game, the main focus is exploration and that sort of thing instead of the focus being on PvP, sure some people like it but some people don’t.
balancing is also an issue, people will always attempt to take the path of least resistance to see big number get bigger, and in this case the path of least resistance is metamancing to kill as many people as possible to get as much renown and infamy as possible, those people i can say without a doubt are problematic
you, on the other hand, are at least more reasonable than those people since you can actually stand and talk calmly about things like this
gods this took longer to type out than I thought it would and I am very tired aaaaaa
please point out any blatantly wrong, bad, or stupid things i’ve said please
quick side note:
i’ve read through pretty much everything on the trello at this point, and Vetex has said that he’s not going to be adding personal banks for non-gravy/asyn players since it was largely used in AA to get around the “dropping money on death” thing and they were underused to begin with (this is in old patch notes from when the game was being revamped into AO, said when he removed banker NPCs and banks in general from the game)
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i dont think killing low levels prepares them for ganking since im already an experienced player
when i was leveling my wind save that i now main today I was ganked during a cargo run that my friend was helping me with. now its fine if this was only a single failed cargo run. But when me and my friend tried attempting to do a cargo run 2 more times she kept disconnecting over and over. that was the ONE DAY my friend had her internet working
and you cant really get away from the low level killer because theyve already dealt half of your health in one hit
if someone is trying to speedrun the game or experiment with your save just be a cooperative person and let them level. They probably already KNOW how to deal with ganks when they reach max level. Not every low level is some unexperienced newbie
I feel that pve clans are inviting. No infamy requirement, no try outs needed. Clans like the Bobbing Fish Co. will let anyone join.
im def not a pve player myself, but everyone has to stop thinking they are above pve and pve is unacceptable
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dang do you have any tips from growing your clan from nothing to something? me and a friend are pretty much the only one getting infamy rn and no one wants to join. i dont wanna do tryouts but i want my clan members to at least be decent
Edit: Sorry for chain post, ill make sure to edit previous post next time
Honestly, most of it was a joint effort between me and my former co-leaders, whom of which I’m still close with to this day. I’ve been asked countless times to make guides and shit on how to actually grow a clan, as I went from nothing to one of the largest clans, if not the most active, in 4 months, then threw it away to focus on school.
I also started Neptune with an irl of mine, and I can say that tryouts are a must if you want to maintain a decent amount of skill in your clan and not ruin your reputation entirely, but then again, it’d be hypocritical if you made a PvP clan without PvPing yourself.
I think my next essay-like topic is gonna be to do with giving tips to others (or finally doing an introduce me topic), so I’ll keep you notified. 
I would love to join a pvp clan… If i didnt average 20 FPS! Pvp clans seem so fun, but lacking the drive to pvp makes them a downtrodden cesspool of acidic waste…
That said im sure its fun having the ability to pvp and experience that joy with others, and its nice to see you voice your opinipns mr. 64
My advice is to have a stable leadership of at least 2 active people, have the clan actually look attractive and not some bank clan, and have a purpose and a discord invite link. Another good option is to get some alliances and have your community actually be, you know, nice to be in. A big issue with big clans is that some people just join them for the sake of it and never talk or interact. So have your clan know each other and have your new members feel comfortable
I average 20 fps too I feel you.
Make sure to only do shit like this with actual friends or people you know well or you’ll end up like me and your clan leader. 
Don’t remind me of that situation there’s a reason I haven’t replied to any of your actual posts
beef prevention strat 101 
Imo the drama wasn’t really caused by the Dark Sealed Chest stealing, but how Noble acted around it, they were uneccesarily toxic, saying “ez” and “free loot” when killing a player that couldn’t really defence himself.
Don’t get me wrong, I think ganking people and stealing Dark Sealeds is fine, but I think they were uneccesarely toxic about it.
Also Dark Sealed Chests need a lootpool buff, just like Saiju said.
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apparently he’s just fucking lazy about it lol